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[?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

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Should we drop A Certain Masked Man?

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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Vita Vesta Caesar on Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:04 am

Everyone's favorite empress is now intruding~☆!(kira kira)

So then, I realize this isn't my thread, and you're wondering what the hell I'm doing posting here. My answer is quite simple: I'm a ta~d pissed looking over what just happened. ...And really, what the actual hell did happen? I may not be a participant of the thread, but I am a member of the community and a friend of Nats (despite everything). And while I may not know Li as well, as a many-time aspirant GM myself who has made and will continue to make many mistakes, I can sympathize with him some here. So here's my thesis statement: you guys are really screwing the two of them over.

Alex, that post of yours. If that's the way you normally act, I don't want you near any of my threads. When a GM makes a mistake, the hell are you supposed to do? It's sure as hell not getting royally pissed about how he screwed you over. No. GMs aren't perfect, they're human. They're trying to make a fun thread, for both the participants and themselves. They don't do this shit because they want to fuck you over, they do it because they want you to have a good time. So you're supposed to fucking work with them.

You said you communicated by posting in the OOC, but you didn't actually communicate at all. No, you didn't say anything to Li. That was a self-righteous complaint letter. You didn't ask him what the hell was up. You didn't pry for answers. You said "Fuck this." and said you were going to leave. You gave him no chance to defend himself, no benefit of the doubt. Did it even cross your mind, the possibility you could talk to him about it before making a decision?

Li's initial response to that was really fucking tame compared to what it deserved, considering the middle finger you'd just given him, so I'm glad to see he spoke up. With the actual person in question declaring the issue, hopefully it'll bring it to the forefront and get you all started on working it out. And yes, you all. The issue isn't just Alex, though he's served as the trigger to bring it to the forefront. And 'it' is something separate from the thread itself, and rooted instead in the community and interpersonal relationships, which is why I'm here giving my opinion piece.

After Alex's initial message, Natsumi tried to highlight how disrespectful and asshole-ish that was. But what happened after was really fucking odd. I see that Alex completely fucking ignored it. I'll get back to that later. After that, Iva popped in, not quite tuned in, and Mura avoided the subject in kind, probably felt uncomfortable tacking it. And then Lem gave her concerns regarding the thread's structure, which while well-intentioned and another valid issue, served as an opportunity for every else to just avoid the topic.

Collectively, you all swerved away from it like it was poison or something. And as for what 'it' is, it's the issue you guys seem to have with talking to Li. It's your issue with talking about Li. It's you and guys and Li. This shit Alex pulled, how you're avoiding the issue. How you try and talk to Natsumi and she has to redirect you to Li, because why would you talk to the actual person when you can talk to someone completely unrelated instead? I understand that Li's kind of disconnected from the community after his long absence from it. And I understand that you might have a bit of a mental block going since you know him better as that Accelerator pic on the sidebar than as an individual. But is this really necessary?

All in all, I see an endless amount of you complaining to each other and Nats instead of Li when you have an issue, you asking Nats for help instead of Li when you need it, and when the topic of your avoidance gets brought up, you avoiding that too. It's really a bit much.

And that second point, regarding Nats, brings me to what drove me to the point of joining in on this happy festival. Why are you asking Nats? Why have I seen Nats have to drag you guys back on course so many times over the course of the OOC? Why is Nats doing anything other than enjoying a good time as a participant instead of having to clean up after our shit for once???

As you may know, Nats has been looking forward to this thread. For a long time. For longer than any of us have been on this forum, Nats has been trying to make it a place where this thread could happen. One where Li could write this plot he's spent years looking forward to. One where Nats could actually have fun, enjoy things as a simple participant; a reward of sorts for her years of effort. Vacation time. She's invested beyond Herculean amounts of effort for the sake of just being able to simply enjoy this one single thread. And she fucking deserves it. I mean, she deals with me. Me. What she wants is nothing more than to have fun. To not have to deal with people being raging assholes, idiots, or wall-builders. To not have to deal with marital spats, stupid arguments, people not posting, people arguing about not posting. People wanting to be spoon-fed, people not putting forth effort, people blaming others. All she wants is to have one thread, one safe haven where she doesn't have to worry about that shit and can just enjoy herself. But right now, all I see is you all doing the exact opposite.

Why the hell are you all going to such effort to ruin it for her? Feel bad. Get it together. Apologize to the two of them. Communicate. Talk to Li about your issues. Talk to Li in general. I'll be the last person to deny that Li could speak up more, but you all aren't in a position to talk, either. Stop pushing work on Nats, she's not here to corral you this time. Stop making work for Nats in general, here. Make work for Li! That's what he's here for, as the GM: to listen to your concerns and thoughts regarding the thread and address them. And I won't give the caveats for that. None of you are new to RPing at this point (save Mura, maybe), and you're neither idiots nor assholes (to this extent or in this way, normally), so you should know them already.

Give Li respect for his position as GM, and respect that Nats is trying to use her beyond well-earned vacation hours that she so rightfully fucking deserves. Respect the work they have and will continue to put in by facing the issue directly, hashing it out with the relevant people, and acting like the people I'd want in my threads that I know you can be. Though I mentioned that to Alex at the beginning, the fact is that this isn't how you normally behave. Get your acts together and start treating Li like you would literally anyone else. Get the fuck off that bus you're running Li and Nats over with, and more than anything else, address the damn issue you can start working things out.

This here is a disaster, but it's also a chance to finally air all that baggage that I've watched you all drag around for the last seven OOC pages. Use it.



That brings me to 'later', back to Alex. This issue is a collective one, but the fact remains that you were the one who really burst things here. I already covered your initial post earlier, but there's still what came after. Now, your second post, after Nats': what were you trying to say? It sounds polite. But I'm genuinely confused and unsure at what you're getting at. My reading comprehension prowess is one of the charm points that make me so wonderful, but I still honestly can't tell what you were trying to say with that, if anything.

Were you backtracking? On the one hand, you apologized for your harshness, but you didn't actually rescind a word you said. Including your intention to leave, even now. Were you following up on your intention to leave with a more graceful farewell, as indicated by "the very least I was grateful"? Your comment in the Pathfinder Discord denies that.

You apologized, but didn't actually apologize for anything. You talked about how you were grateful for what you'd managed to do before this happened and an expression of sympathy, but they were just flowery words that didn't actually say anything, except perhaps further harden the stance you'd previously established in your initial post, ironically enough.

So what were you trying to do with that post? It didn't respond to anything. There wasn't anything to respond to. It just sort of lacks of substance and exists as a response for the sake of you being able to say you responded, as far as I can tell.

And in both that response and your third, you basically thanked him for folding in the face of your incandescent rage, which is decidedly unhelpful in repairing your reputation as a player a GM wants in their thread. Everyone else kind of just ignored the issue and pretended the elephant wasn't there, but you alone not only violently brought the issue to fore, but then seemed to actively and somewhat awkwardly push it away and try to dance around it.

So I'd like to see a direct response from you. Not only in regards to all that, but also in regards to the issue of you leaving. That's not the sort of thing you can just pretend never happened and avoid addressing, especially the way you said it. What are your thoughts to all this? Even more than everyone else, Nats and Li deserve a proper response from you specifically after all this, to know exactly what went through your head and lead to this mess.

And Lem, no, you're not overstepping your bounds. I'm pretty sure I've managed to stay away from the pitfall of assuming (and we know what they say about that), but regardless, not only is keeping quiet here not something I was okay with after seeing what was happening, I was also well into writing this monstrosity at the time of your post. So sorry if it seems like I'm ignoring your response. No ill will meant.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Kita Tsukiko on Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:53 am

After reading wall after wall of crap on top of crap, I think I've reached a point where I need to post. I think we've spent more time posting in this OOC about this specific issue than we have posting any actual IC content. I've been trying to not to get involved because I'm not interested in getting involved in the shitstorm, but I think it's gotten to a point where I need to say this:

Many of us involved in this scene, especially myself, have made a mistake in some way and with varying degrees of consequences. The fact of the matter is I'm ready to move past this issue and start patching things up, moving through this scene, and moving onto the night scene. However, the more time we spend writing walls upon walls addressing the same issue again and again, the less time and motivation we're gonna have to continue this thing, and I guarantee that this is not what ANY of us want at all. So, I'm ready to fix my goddamn mistake and move on, and I'm ready for each of us to do the same. I'm not gonna split this into multiple sections because I'm tired of reading walls, everyone who's made mistakes knows who they are, and they know how to fix it. So let's get to it, shall we?
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Mugino Shizuri on Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:24 am

Good morning~!

I went to sleep last night, expecting the WWE going wild, however it didn't end up that bad.

Reading both Sheepy’s and Jack Natsu’s friend’s posts I feel a little happy that there is still reason speaking. I do agree with Lem that we should all take a step back, think about what is wrong here and work towards it in a friendly and understanding manner. The problem with that, however is that some people do not seem to understand the problem, or not wish to.

This isn’t something you can brush off a la: «Uuuh, I don’t wanna read any walls anymore!»

Or: «Yeah, I did a mistake! Instead of talking about it, I will simply move forward!»

Or: «We’re talking more in here than we actually play!»

If you are not willing to read through this and build up your own thoughts about it or a remote kind of understanding of the problems, you will not solve them. Hell, claiming that it is the same problem being brought up over and over again, is way off the mark. This was the first time it was raised by Guy, with only a fraction of the people addressed responding to it. And even if it wasn’t, the problem clearly wasn’t sorted out, was it?

Saying that you saw your mistake on top of that makes it even less believable. Did you really see it? Or are you just saying things to please people here and go on, ready to do it right around the next corner? I don’t see any self reflection here. Nor do I see a proper interest towards change. All I am currently witnessing here, is just someone annoyed by an attempt to fix problems, trying to brush them under the carpet again. And frankly that is not what I expect from you guys. Hell, this is exactly bringing us back to the things that disappoint me so much about you.

Lastly, just a little friendly reminder: This OOC is supposed to be posted in so that we can talk and plan outside the actual play. It is there to complain and there to discuss certain issues when they arise. That means this kind of thing occurs naturally. Looking at HS for example, we probably talked more than 100 times as much as we posted there and it helped. It would help here, as well, if people were ready to actually talk. Some are, as seen by the ratio of posts they have written here. Some simply can’t say anything, because everything is sorted out for them. And then there’s those that were addressed in this frequent discussion.

I don’t know, if any of you realised it, but this isn’t an attempt to warn you about troubles or simply raise an issue. This is a gun’s barrel being directed right at you. Your very last chance~
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Oda Taichi on Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:49 am

Before we begin, I only think its right that I say this first. There had been no intention whatsoever to cause any offence that seemed to have been unknowingly caused by my original post. And it was clear me acting like my usual 'arsehole' self-hadn't exactly help.

So again, I offer my sincere apologies.

Not once when writing that post had there been any intention to cause this level of disruption or to offend anyone here. Seeing it now, it's understandable that Guy was offended by it as it came off as me attacking how he managed it. So I apologise to him and to Nats for seemingly ruining the thread by this disruption.

Though I was frustrated it doesn't excuse me from how I worded that post.

Now, 'Oh blimey' would be the appropriate response, since I'll be honest I thought my little chin-wag with Guy in PMs was the end of it. So this caught me off-guard and honestly didn't understand what triggered this last night. So while I had thought about writing something up, and actually I had, it was decided to leave it until the morning.

From my understanding, it seems a further explanation is needed regarding my original post. So I'll be offering it here.

Firstly at the beginning, it seemed Guy was precluding any real talk or help from the start by what seemed rather dismissive with the whole "Finding your own reasons to get involved" line which didn't help when I and others were struggling to get moving. Then seemingly it had all looked like the plot points and easy hooks were falling into the lap of the dark side characters. So it felt like if you're not part of the dark side you would have to run the long stretch on your own. This all had made me feel reluctant to discuss this with Guy directly and get help from the beginning. Of course, I understand this wasn't the case now and that I should've been honest about that from the start.

Secondly, let me explain what I intended by the idea of Oda leaving this thread. Firstly I saw it as a natural consequence for Oda not being able to properly build up his motivations to see this through. You know like the lion never found his courage? So he backed out. And that I thought it would be beneficial to help ease on what I see as a problem. That being the large cast which I thought would help make things easier to manage with one less person. By being seemingly told by that "Find your own reason" line that the GM wasn't interested in talking (See above), I was only confused and frustrated when I was then chastised for not talking to the person I thought wasn't interested in talking.

It had honestly left me to feel disconnected.

Now Thirdly regarding the time skip, combining the other two points. It felt like the moment I actually had got a sense of direction, by working with the others that it was all brushed aside without even prior warning. It had made any sense of effort to try to get things down was meaningless and unwanted. So it had led to my frustration that I thought it was best to see myself out of the thread.  

And I think that really explains it all, the decision to skip really just topped all my frustrations leading to my original post. So that's it and I hope it provides some understanding of my original post. And I'm all but willingly to help find a solution to the problems faced here.

Even if it means shaving some characters from the cast since I do feel that would be beneficial. That we all should have a relook at the entire cast and see who really suits the tone for this RP.

Also again I apologise for causing this disruption and I'm more than happy to help find a solution here.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Damion Koyoko on Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:14 pm

I really don't want to prolong this discussion, but I feel like I need to say my piece on this discussion regarding to all the complaints. And I'll try to keep it as organized as possible. I'll be addressing the main concern of characters not yet fully motivated or rather engaged with the plot, and having little idea of how to get their characters involved without forcing a solution. I'll also be addressing about how exactly I believe people handled the situation, and how it should have been handled.

1. "My character can't get involved, and I'm not being told how to, or unsure how to myself and this timeskip feels too abrupt!":

I can totally see why people are frustrated about this, but when reading the OOC, i feel like people do not understand what they were supposed to be doing. I'll put it out plainly again: Players were supposed to have their characters get involved with the Masked Man by either indirect or direct means. This would include listening to rumors, talking to citizens, looking at news reports of past murders, talk to law enforcement if possible about what they might think of said rumors, looking for evidence and doing and investigation, whatever it takes to make your character motivated to learn more, or to otherwise investigate themselves.

This was reiterated not once, not twice, but several times from Nats, Guy and Lemmy-chan, Nats specifically showing frustration in the OOC when no one seemed to look into the rumors when we first started. I even myself suggested people can even ask MY character about these rumors way before hand, to get people involved.

The timeskip as was mentioned earlier was given advanced warning, but it feels abrupt because not every player is ready to skip to the night, that is completely understandable, but what I'm going to talk about next is what you guys, I BELIEVE you did wrong in this situation.

2. Lack of Communication

I wanted to ask this quite plain and simple when everyone said they don't know how to proceed: Did you PM Guy? Did you try to contact him and say 'Hey, I'm confused, can you help me?' The OOC isn't the only avenue for asking for help. Guy is very concise and quick on PMs, and is certainly willing to make some suggestions for you.

But what I saw instead is people showing concern in the OOC, not really taking suggestions that may or may not have been provided, and proceeded to go down an 'SoL' like posting train, where little to no progress was made and no one can be motivated, and simply waited for something rather than seeking it out.

In fact, that lack of communication was extremely apparent when I was suddenly told 'Hey by the way, a group of people will be interrogating you now' Without even telling me any of this ahead of time. It didn't make any sense to me, I was completely lost and it seemed like this decision was already made without me.

3. "So what should I have done?"

Certainly not blaming the GM, for starters. Even if it wasn't in the intent of blaming him, or was in an intent to criticise his decisions to the point of questioning him as a GM, but I can only read those posts as if it was to blame Guy for these problems, which i utterly found disgusting, disheartening, and overall irresponsible.

THANKFULLY! Most if not everyone who the above applies to has apologised for either bad wording, or just giving off the wrong impression. And while it's not the apology I WOULD prefer, at least it was said. But that doesn't solve the issue, so what should you do now?

From what I'm gathering Guy is reverting his decision for you guys to get hooked into the plot, and motivated enough to go out during Curfew to investigate the masked man. And we have little time to do it lest we get behind schedule even more. So I'm going to give the same suggestions I said earlier, since it appears everyone is gathering anyway, unless something has changed.

First off Under NO circumstances will Koyoko be willing to spill any information about his job. While he doesn't realise what kind of job he has, ICly, he would never reveal such details if asked, let alone no one actually knows what his job is. It is Darkside knowledge, and spilling it would mean the potential death of my character. So if you're hoping this is the perfect solution, I am going to stop you right there.

Secondly, while everyone is gathered for seemingly coincidental reasons, I have no idea, this is a perfect time for someone to talk about the rumors of the Masked Man and for someone to jump out and give evidence on just how valid of an existence this 'vigilante' or 'criminal' is.

Koyoko being a delinquent, would be greatly aware of these rumors being that the people being attacked are well in his social status. Skillout is thinning in numbers out of fear, Runners who are often hired like he is are suddenly not taking jobs saying 'It's too dangerous' or 'I don't want to be killed'. NOT arrested, but KILLED. Koyoko can easily put out information about the masked man, without revealing a word about his job and without directly connecting himself with anything.

Info he can give:
1. The Masked man seems to attack only at night.
2. He seems to attack people of a lower social class (Delinquents, Skill-Out, Criminals, People who are breaking Curfew)
3. Perhaps Anti-skill's security for the past week has doubled during Curfew hours, hinting that they are possibly believing in these 'rumors', claiming a friend of his went out during curfew and saw way more patrols then usual.


I can go on, but there are ways to get people interested in the masked man, the whole point of this brief period of nothing really happening. SO if we're going to be grouped up, I can help get people involved without compromising my character, it just took a little imagination is all.

And if you can't use any of this or it's not enough for your character to get even a little bit curious of what goes on during curfew hours with the Masked man, all you neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed to do, is just ask for help. You don't have to twiddle your thumbs, feel sorry for yourself, or get mad at others for not having a way in.

★~C~O~M~M~U~N~I~C~A~T~E~★

*Coughs up blood* I'm never typing that again...

Now, let's just FINALLY STOP THIS FUCKING WALL TRAIN WE HAVE GOING!

I hope my words weren't disheartening anyone, but it's my opinion of how we should proceed and how we should avoid something like this in the future.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Oda Taichi on Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:07 pm

Anyway, you guys ask for communication, so I'm going to communicate with you this concern. If the time skip happens or not, there is something that has been a brick wall in my mind. Even Lem mentions that Oda not wanting to get other students involved is a good character reason. And it's this which I'm having trouble with.

Oda intends to go to the apartment to investigate and both Kita along with Mirai (OOC) has shown interest to come along. But that's the thing, I cannot fathom any reason why Oda will let them get involved on his own. Since this is clearly a dangerous situation. I have a clear mind to why Oda will do it, but you guys have any ideas? If you want to come along with him you will need to convince him. Maybe some sort of dialogue the others can use to talk him into it? Or blackmailing him, you will investigate this on your own anyway, making it pointless to resist your demands?

And maybe I don't know, they tag along by basically stalking him to the apartment?
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Damion Koyoko on Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:30 pm

I think you're making it more complicated then it needs to be, in my opinion. Oda can't actually force them not to get involved. They may even go to the apartment on their own fruition, or EVEN openly admit it in front of him in a stubborn act of rebellion.

Basically Oda will have two choices at that point:

1. Investigate on his own and try to keep them from going in, which we know he actually cant as they'd just come at an earlier or later time.

2. Reluctantly lets them, but Oda will be there to at least watch them this time around. He can proper a common police procedure to check the apartment out for any immediate danger, before investigating anything, thus making any concern for their safety diminished, at least temporarily.




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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Kita Tsukiko on Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:35 pm

Even if Oda wouldn't let Kita not come along, she would find a way to either tail Oda until he gets to the apartment or just up and front say "I'm coming along no matter what you say". So, pretty much whatever you wanna do with Oda works, cause no matter what you choose I can act accordingly.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Oda Taichi on Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:43 pm

Probably am just overthinking it.

Well, I'm not exactly saying force them, but he wouldn't cooperate with them to put them in a dangerous situation. He wants them to be safe, so they will have to force the situation and Kita being her stubborn self would be ... of course now sticking to Oda like glue until he gives in.. its just to see how Mirai will go about it inb4 to girls teaming up to whip Oda into their lacky.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Aleister Crowley on Mon Sep 25, 2017 8:15 pm

For my two pennies worth, I'd say blackmail seems perfectly workable too. Considering they'd both be aware that investigating a suspect/victim's apartment is well beyond the purview of a Judgment member they'd easily be able to leverage that against him.

i.e. "Maybe we should tell the authorities you're breaking and entering?"

Or even

"Maybe we should tell the authorities that you've been tampering with evidence." (referring to the keycard, of course.)
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Oda Taichi on Mon Sep 25, 2017 8:38 pm


ACertainAccelerator: Posted in OOC re; Oda's decision.
alexanderbeathen: Blackmail poor Oda seems the better idea overall.
alexanderbeathen: T-T
ACertainAccelerator: As I say, seems the obvious easy route, given that he's opening himself up to it.
Libertas719: And in the event they get caught...
alexanderbeathen: We're the bastard children
Libertas719: "W-We were just following this guy! The Judgement member! He said it was okay!"
alexanderbeathen: Anti-skill knows him shit.
ACertainAccelerator: And he's linked to the investigation.
ACertainAccelerator: AS A SUSPECT...
alexanderbeathen: Exactly.
alexanderbeathen: So whats life in prison I wonder..
alexanderbeathen: I hope the food is good.
ACertainAccelerator: Ideally this chat would go on record in the OOC but hypothetically he could get caught on camera around the apartment.
ACertainAccelerator: Giving him all the more reason to find the Masked Man and clear his name.

Just recording an off thread chat about this topic.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Kaneko Mirai on Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:04 pm

I'd like to know what you guys think of my idea here:

Mirai will namedrop the Masked Man and the basics of the rumours in front of everyone as she confronts Taichi. She will demand that he show her what the keycard leads to, or else she will do it herself. Perhaps make up some reason that she's interested in the case, and resort to those aforementioned threats/blackmail if he resists. Koyoko could even speak up about the rumours himself to confirm them and prove she's not someone making stuff up?

Ideally, after this we should transition to the apartment asap, for those who want to be there for that. It's tempting to do a round or two where everyone talks about going there or not as that's a more natural flow of conversation, but I feel we should be focused on moving there first and including any complaints or questions only after they've arrived. Mirai's already proven herself to be forceful enough to make people follow along anyway without knowing all the facts.

What we do once we arrive at the apartment on the other hand, is another matter entirely. We could always go with my earlier idea for some detail, or if Guy has anything planned for us there, that's fine too.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Oda Taichi on Tue Sep 26, 2017 1:59 am

I think that sounds like a real plan, go ahead and confront Taichi next. To really kick things off.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Kaneko Mirai on Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:40 pm

I'd like to hear from everyone else first. Guy, Koyoko, Mura, Turtle, do you think this plan of action is one we should pursue?

I also thought about the possibility of having the apartment search take place at night so that Nats and Iva get to do things again and the plot as a whole can start to move forward, but I don't know if this search was meant to be take place before the next big step or not. If so, we can get on taking care of it asap so we can all move on. Let me know, anyway.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Kita Tsukiko on Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:45 pm

I personally think that it would be better if the apartment search took place at night. Not only would it move things along and give people an opportunity to post, but it would also kind of make more sense. After all, last I checked people break into apartments and homes more often under the cover of night than when it's bright and easy for everyone to see. As for the plan, that seems like a good plan to follow as to move things along smoothly.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Oda Taichi on Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:47 pm

Well is it really breaking an entering if we have the key? Come on guys we're the bastard children! But yes let it happen at night so everyone can do something.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Aleister Crowley on Tue Sep 26, 2017 10:08 pm

Ideally the search of the apartment would take place before Koyoko picks up his delivery, since the point of the scene would be to give them evidence pointing towards the package's destination to draw them there. Same with the information Miyako dredged up from the victim's emails and the list that Mugino retrieved from the courier company.

That said, assuming they discover said evidence and hurry to the delivery point we could easily alter things to say that they arrive just as the action is going down.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Damion Koyoko on Tue Sep 26, 2017 10:27 pm

Kaneko Mirai wrote:I'd like to hear from everyone else first. Guy, Koyoko, Mura, Turtle, do you think this plan of action is one we should pursue?

I also thought about the possibility of having the apartment search take place at night so that Nats and Iva get to do things again and the plot as a whole can start to move forward, but I don't know if this search was meant to be take place before the next big step or not. If so, we can get on taking care of it asap so we can all move on. Let me know, anyway.

I'm fine with the idea mentioned before, and if you're going to do it at night, it needs to be before 10PM, so maybe between 7-9pm depending on whatever you decide. Oda can take Koyoko to the Judgement offices to finish paper work or whatever, and ultimately lets him go, giving Oda plenty of time to go meet back up with Kita and Mirai to investigate the apartment under the cover of night.

And YES, it is considered breaking and entering if you're entering someone's apartment without permission. Key =/= Ownership~. Just saying.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Oda Taichi on Tue Sep 26, 2017 10:34 pm

I know was trying to be funny, but we can skip the judgement office thing.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Takamiya Jin on Wed Sep 27, 2017 1:41 am

Well, as was stated in my first post, Jin knows the basics of the rumors- He just doesn't believe they're real enough to be worth investigating. However with proof that he's real... That gives Jin a pretty solid reason to want to follow up on this. After all, while it's roughly a 92% chance that he's from the Dark Side, that 8% chance that the masked man somehow is able to evade Academy City's security is something Jin can't afford to not look into if he wants to get out of this place.

As for the plan, I think it's a good one. I'm just not sure I want to be a part of it. After all, Jin will have learned what he was sticking around for- The quest Mirai was bringing up. Obviously he has no interest in a student watch group. And from an out of character perspective, the group's starting to inflate a bit too much for my tastes, which will inflate the time it takes. Having Jin split off and regroup after the time skip might help speed things up a bit. Of course, it could also make things more complicated, so I'll have to talk to Guy about it- Mainly what routes I could find to the package through solo investigation without taking more time than just meekly following everyone else. I can do either, though, so it's really just what works best for the thread as a whole.



Now, apparently I'm supposed to relate my thoughts on all those walls that went down last week. So here it is. There's been a lot of miscommunication, as much as there's been flat out non-communication. A lot of that's from my side, it just hadn't been really pointed out as a problem until now. That's nothing new, it's been said a thousand times. All we can really do is learn from the experience, and try to do better.

Now then, my view of the whole debacle from last week. I honestly don't know what to say, so I'll just spew some word vomit, and hopefully people get something from it.

The first time I knew people had concerns with the thread was way back at the beginning, long before the time skip that set off this whole thing. This was back in July, when Lem came to me with her concerns- Primarily, that there was a set point she was supposed to go to- And couldn't, because doing so would be asking for a Meltdowner or five. Now, I believe this exact point has been brought up a few times already, so there's hopefully not much left to say about it.

The second concern I know of, is that certain characters were felt to be overshadowing others- Specifically, all of the GM interactions were geared towards specific characters- Mugino and Natsumi. It felt like they were being set up as 'protagonists' while everyone else was literally filler so it didn't look like the thread was moderator exclusive.

Now, if I have been reading correctly, the response to this concern has basically been, that we should have gone to Guy and worked it out. Which sounds reasonable, I guess. But honestly, one common factor between the people who had this problem- We've never been in a Guy thread before. Apparently, doing that is common in Guy's threads, but in every other thread we've been in so far, that's not how it's worked. If we're not told that's what's expected of us, there's no way we'll know what is expected of us, and can only rely on experience. It shouldn't be on us to ask what we're expected to do if it's any different from the normal experience. At least, that's how I feel on the matter.

It was around this time that I made my first post in the thread, deciding to tag along with Mirai for a few reasons- Firstly, she was the only real lead I had to the Masked Man- Other than the rumors, which in my first post I explained why he didn't follow. It just didn't seem likely to be real, or even for there to be anything to find if he looked! As such, I can't say that my decision to tag along with her was wrong. And just as importantly, Mirai looked fun to RP with, and in the end, that's what matters.

Fast forward four posts over the course of 2 and a half weeks (August 28 - September 16).

I'm just going to sleep, when I'm told to look at the thread. Our scene has been cut short, at possibly the worst time- We've only just come across Koyoko- But before he even has a chance to react to our presence, or we even know what the heck is going on or why we should care about him- Apparently being supposed to work all that out OoC.

And this is where the fun begins.

Now, for my part, I screwed up. I didn't know what was going on, and was already on Skype, so I asked Nacchan instead of Guy about what was going on. That was a mistake, and I do not intend to make it a second time.

Anyways, apparently we'd been told it was coming. I insist that that is false- None of the people in the scene recall these weekly warnings that it was coming- and regardless, a warning that nobody knows about should not count. What matters is, nothing was said in this OoC thread about it, so I can't say we deserve any blame for finding it unexpected. If it was just one of us who missed it, okay, their bad- But everyone?

Anyways, this is where the shit hits the fan. Lem and Alex start feeling like the concerns they've had have not been addressed- Even with Lem directly contacting Guy. Myself? I was having fun, so I didn't mind as much and didn't have any concerns that felt worth bringing up. Anyways, this is when Alex decides to post his ultimatum.

I feel like there was some miscommunication here, as while Alex had not directly talked to Guy, he was in contact with Lem who had, so I imagine it would have felt redundant to bring up the same concern twice. Of course, I'm not Alex, so I can't say if that was actually his thought process or not. In any case, the time skip became the final straw in terms of, "Our characters don't matter as long as we're here to fill a body count."

Anyways, that's the background leading up to Alex's explosion, so hopefully you understand some of the underlying tensions that had brought everything the way it did. It wasn't just a random outburst, it was because it felt like the concerns which, while had not been brought up by he himself, Lem had brought up felt like they were being ignored.

Of course, to me, this is the only time I had a concern worth bringing up- And yes, I brought it up in the wrong place, but that's not what matters. From where I stand, I had made four posts, and half a month and was being told that I was going off track and taking too long- In those four posts, I met Mirai, met Kita, then we transitioned to the scene with Koyoko and Oda- Something that we had been told multiple times we should have been aiming to do. I'm new enough to RPing that I won't try to judge whether or not we were becoming SoL, but it felt like something weird was going on. After such a short time, with no indication we were doing anything wrong, suddenly we're told that we were becoming SoL and it needed to be cut off before it went any longer. No warning, just a sudden skip.

Now, I try to voice that- Only to be told, paraphrased, that "No, it was warned of well in advance, this is your problem for not paying attention, and you told the wrong person about it. Now, it's already been dealt with, so please keep to relevant topics. Also, you're being an asshole to Guy by complaining about how he does things."

I doubt this is how it was meant, but it's totally how it came across. Not exactly conductive to a civil discourse, which led to me basically dropping out of the conversation- I'd already left my concerns behind, and didn't really want to get into the middle of all this.

And then Lem started to mediate. Which was nice, and gave me hope that everything would calm down and we could start to figure stuff out- Even though it meant that she was giving up on voicing the concerns she had been having. And it sounded like she was going to give voice to those concerns once it sounded like everyone had calmed down enough to actually listen to each other, instead of falling into the, "It doesn't matter that we communicated poorly, because you communicated poorly too!" argument people were devolving into. Two wrongs never make a right.

And that pretty much brings us to present day.

You asked for a wall, you got a wall. I'm sure I phrased things poorly in here, but hopefully my point gets across.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Vita Vesta Caesar on Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:49 am

The GLORIOUS ROMA INCURSION continues. brilliant smile

So, Slrar, you've given me a lot to respond to, here, and I'm afraid none of it is good. I'll start from the 'apparently'. Nats, Iva, Li, and my posts, as well as Nats' constant reminders to you for the better part of the last week really should have made it more than clear that youーas well as every member of the threadーwere expected to respond to the topic. Any indication otherwise, I'm afraid, is indicative less of reality than of the seeming lack of care you have for the topic. Now, I'm sure your response will be something along the lines of that you really don't care, that you don't think this should be or want it to be an issue, and that you don't want to get involved regardless. I can sympathize with those feelings, they're reasonable. But you acting on them indicates something else that you should be aware of: that you don't care for the seriousness and concern your fellow participants have for it. It may not be a large concern for you. But it clearly is for many others, and for you to attempt to flee from the topic despite the need for you to weigh in because of your very real relevance as a contributor to the issue and general participant of the thread tramples on that. This doesn't just go to Slrar, but to the other members of this thread who harbor similar sentiments as well. You may not want to, but as you should be aware given that you're not children, you not wanting to do something doesn't mean you don't have to do it.

Next, regarding any perceived 'moderator exclusivity', directed to all those who shared those concerns. There are two things I want you to take into account and give the issue a second look with, if you haven't already. First, the fact Iva and Natsumi are just players here, like any other. Like all of you. They aren't working as GMs, as co-GMs, or in some sort of conspiracy, and this isn't a private thread. They're here to have fun. With you. They're here to have a good time, because with all the hard work they do for the forum, they too are RPers who want to just RP sometimes. And what better place to do that in but in Li's thread, their sole superior and therefore a thread that they shouldn't have to manage at all, unlike every other thread on the forum?

Second, in terms of them being geared as protagonists which is cited as the apparent cause for that impression. Go back to the first page of this OOC. There, you will see Li, Iva, Nats, and all of you as well talking about where and how to start off the thread. What was decided was that the dark side charactersーMiyako and Muginoーshould go first at the night time because due to their roles in their side they were suited to go right in for the plot. They didn't get special attention. They got all the attention that was necessary for them, given their place in the plot. As for why they got to that place in the plot, it was because they had the motivations and means to do so. As Koyoko has demonstrated, when you too get yourself into the thick of things and actually have things for Li to update for you, you too will get that same attention. This isn't favoritism. This is just things going exactly as they were discussed with everyone at the beginning of the thread and Li giving updates where updates were needed.

Now, back to Slrar specifically. "But honestly, one common factor between the people who had this problem- We've never been in a Guy thread before. Apparently, doing that is common in Guy's threads, but in every other thread we've been in so far, that's not how it's worked." You'll have to pardon my French, butーthat's total BS. I'll start explaining why by crushing the entire premise behind that: there is nothing special about a 'Guy thread'. That special category of thread that functions differently from normal threads does not exist. This is actually the very issue that this whole conversation is supposed to tackle; the idea that Masked Man and Li are somehow different and are to be treated differently.

Turtle. The response to concerns about a thread being to talk to the GM about them is nothing special at all. It's what you're supposed to do in literally every thread. And if it's experience doing that, you have it. I know very well, from how many hours long discussions erupted around Reichenbach and the Pathfinder during its initial beginningーyou shits weren't shy at all when it came to addressing your concerns loudly and proudly~ And that same pattern has held true for literally every thread I've GM'd: an issue popped up? People have made sure to complain~ And that remains still true for every thread I've participated in, as well. So yeah, that entire paragraph of yours, the contents, it's just inexcusable BS, wrong on so many levels, and it is damn worrying in the extreme that you think that.

Next: "I insist that that is false- None of the people in the scene recall these weekly warnings that it was coming-" My response is this: http://academycity.forumotion.co.uk/t842p125-a-certain-masked-man-ooc#8868 It is not false (even Koyoko knew of it), it was indeed said in this OOC, there are no excuses for you to not have known about it, and it was said at the beginning of the month, while it is now the end of it. You were indeed warned that you should be fast-tracking your way down to the next scene long in advance. When Li saw that the time was ripe, that a reasonable amount of time had passed and you all had the reasons to be at the next scene he'd asked you to get, he moved on. We've already established that Li could've done a better job letting you know when he was about to do it, but the fact that you were asked to wrap your scene up and were given a sizable amount of time to do so irrefutable.  And if you have a problem with that, if you have an issue with that decision of his in terms of thread flow or pace for whatever reason, then you also had a good amount of time to voice those concerns and have them dealt with beforehand.

And continuing down the grocery list, we have... This: "while Alex had not directly talked to Guy, he was in contact with Lem who had" So then, there's a couple of issues here. First off is the one Nats has been reiterating: complaining to fellow players instead of the GM. So first is why was he in contact with Lem, instead of Li? That's an issue from the onset. And about it having felt redundant to bring up the same concern twice, think about it: one person complains about a fairly serious issue, multiple people complain about a less serious issue. Which do you think is going to be taken more seriously? It's the one that there appears to be a group consensus on. The other issue may be more serious, but its apparently only serious to one person. In other words, far from redundant, it's incredibly important that you voice your complaints regardless of how many other people have already done so. It clarifies your stance, it strengthens the issue, it makes it clearer that there is indeed an issue... All not speaking does is forfeit your right to complain. Because you didn't. By all appearances, you were 100% fine with what was going on, and that becomes your vote.

And going back to the 'our characters are just to add to the body count', since you went back to it about here: I've already gone into why Mugino and Miyako got more attention from the GM. It's because they had hooked themselves into the plot and started doing things for him to pay attention to. So what do you think the intent behind the time skip was, especially given the wording of Li's request (for you to get yourself a reason to be present in the plot later that night)? It was to get you involved. It was to give you the attention you apparently felt undeservingly starved of. He wasn't being some ass trying to push you off the stage. He was doing what a GM is supposed to do and pushing you onto the stage.

So yes, while it may not have been a random outburst (I've never thought it was, to be clear), that by no means means that it was a reasonable one.

And in terms of your paraphrasing of how it came across, well. 1. You're ignoring how it was recognized from the beginning by everyone involved from Nats to Li to Alex that Li could've given you a bit more warning. "No, it was warned of well in advance, this is your problem for not paying attention" completely ignores that. 2. I genuinely can't see where "Now, it's already been dealt with, so please keep to relevant topics." comes into play; the ones who were trying to gloss over the issue because it was 'already dealt with' were Alex, you, Mura, etc. 3. "Also, you're being an asshole to Guy by complaining about how he does things." You add this to the end, you apparently see it as some random thing was tacked on? But that's the main point. The greatest point, the giant issue, the pink elephant in the room. It's how you gave your complaints to each instead of Alex. It's how you all thought he was brushing your characters off in favor of others when it was just clear logical proceedings based on who was doing what, and he was doing what he could to put your characters in the position to receive the same. It's not also; if anything, it should be the entirety of your paraphrasing.

And you bring up how two wrongs don't make a right, like people were trying to brush off Li's poor communication. But that's not what people were doing at all. Whether it was Nats, Li, Iva, or me, we all noted that Li as well had issues with his communication to sort out. There was absolutely no semblance of "It doesn't matter that we communicated poorly, because you communicated poorly too!"; the issue that was being pushed, the thesis they were and are supporting was and is 'Li screwed up here and his communication could certainly be better, but you all are ignoring the fact that your communication is just as poor or worse, and you are tackling the thread and its issues in strange and negative ways that do not reflect how would have done so in literally any thread but this.' It is recognized that there all issues on all sidesーbut until Alex's ultimatum only one side's (Li's) issues had been spoken about. Honestly, that is a gross and almost insulting misrepresentation.

All in all, a worrying percentage of the issues I've outlined here (and many previous ones) seem to result from a simple lack of attentionーto the OOC, to the thread, to what people are saying. It's like you just flat-out missed all the important stuff, even though it's right here in the OOC.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Oda Taichi on Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:16 pm

-restrains self- But guys, please make sure not to brush aside any opinions made on here, even if you don't agree with them that is how the person had felt. So try to understand them even if it makes you angry, the point is to understand why they saw it that way.

Anyway, there is clear reason for me to go next but does anyone else involved with the current scene want to post? Koyoko, Turtle or Mura?

EDIT: Mura said he will go after, turtle and turtle after Koyoko so get on it you! No more dilly-dallying!
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Damion Koyoko on Thu Sep 28, 2017 4:54 pm

Koyoko is overdue a post since he's been silent up till now, and not posting anything would just be weird. I'll come up with stuff that'll be useful for the conversation
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Aleister Crowley on Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:24 pm

Right, now that everyone has voiced their concerns and opinions I intend to address them as best I can so that hopefully we can move on from these problems and make a fresh start. I'm hoping this will be the last wall of text we need to deal with for the foreseeable future.

But for the sake of everyone's sanity when scrolling through the thread I'm going to spoiler it so it's not taking up half a page. Razz

My reply.:

So, to address the posts that came after mine (and I must absolutely stress that this is not a post written in anger, nor is it meant to lay blame on anyone. I am not looking to absolve myself from blame for being uncommunicative, merely prove that I was not acting unfairly towards anyone in particular). I'm hoping this doesn't spark any more hard feelings and further arguments but rather closes this rather unfortunate chapter of the thread.

Important parts are bolded.

Alex wrote:Firstly at the beginning, it seemed Guy was precluding any real talk or help from the start by what seemed rather dismissive with the whole "Finding your own reasons to get involved" line which didn't help when I and others were struggling to get moving.

I'm sorry it seemed that way. However, I have made a point of signing off a number of my posts in this OOC with some variation of 'please talk to me if you need any help'. But so far the only people who contacted me regarding the thread were Natsumi, Iva, Lemouri and Mura.

Page 4 wrote:If the rest of you have any trouble figuring out what to do next just ask here and we can point you in the right direction.

Page 5 wrote:As always, if anyone has any questions or feels lost then just ask.

Page 6 wrote:As ever, any problems, just say and I (or Natsumi apparently. Sorry you've had to become the defacto secondary thread runner here) will help put you on the right track.

Not to mention the fact that I spent the first few pages of the thread actively throwing around suggestions for people. I only stopped because I didn't want people to feel railroaded into choosing a course of action just because I suggested it.

e.g.:

Page 1 wrote:Well there are a couple of obvious plot hooks for people who don't have an overt reason to join in.

They could coincidentally happen by the scene of the crime just as it's occurring. (Don't worry, I won't initiate an instant bad end, though picking a fight with our antagonist might not end well for your character.)

Or they might come across the aftermath (and probably have to deal with Anti Skill when they arrive.)

Failing that my next scene was possibly going to be the arrival of Anti Skill to investigate, which might offer some more incentives and possibilities.

They might already be investigating the rumour of a Masked psycho (I'm thinking someone naturally curious like Kita for instance.)

Someone like Oda might hear about the incident through their friends/coworkers at Judgement.

Mugino could be forced to investigate via orders from her superiors in the Dark Side.

These are all just possible suggestions to give you ideas though. Think about your characters and what might be an interesting way to get them searching for the Masked Man, whether it relates to the opening crime scene or their personal motivations.

In this instance I would be happy to amend the OP to hep people get on their feet, but in future threads that might not be the case.

Page 1 wrote:
Mugino Shizuri wrote:
Hujisaka Natsumi wrote:I was rather saying that it's either a daytime skip, or the dark side members and other shady characters go first. The underdogs aren't going to wait until the sun's out to do their stuff. Trying to pull off both would just be kinda awkward.
I'm actually going to second this.

Not entirely sure how to start it off, but I think I could do a Mugino arguing over the phone kinda thing.

That was my first idea. Perhaps sending her after the same item the Masked Man just stole or after MM himself.

Kaneko Mirai wrote:After some thought, I've decided to change Mirai's situation for this plot so that she is post-incident, that is, transferred to Sakugawa and in a wheelchair, embittered. As for getting involved in the plot, now that few care about what she does and where she goes, going out at night is no longer as much of an issue. She will be searching for her ex-lover's whereabouts, as well as idly considering the possibility of finding out if the so-called Masked Man killed him, or if she could somehow find and convince the Masked Man to go after him for her.

In any case, she will be around there at night by chance and be drawn to the commotion caused by the first responders discovering the scene of the crime. If any of this will end up posing a problem, let me know.

That could be interesting. Though if she tries to enlist his help I doubt he'll be particularly cooperative. Exactly how 'uncooperative' he might be is a matter of circumstances though. In either case would she be turning up on the night of the murder or going out looking for him another night?

Oda Taichi wrote:Post incident? Hmm Oda and Kaneko are in the same school then. So maybe we could do something there? Unless you want to do your own thing? Let me know.

This is good. Depending on how you two want to handle their relationship they could be introduced together or separately. (Are they friends? Does Taichi follow Mirai out of concern for her safety even though she doesn't know or want him there? Or does she drag him along? Perhaps they both happen to be out at the same time for different reasons?)

Takamiya Jin wrote:Honestly, Jin probably just got bored and decided to chase down a guy that doesn't exist because he felt like having wild goose for dinner.

He could also, as Guy suggested, stumble upon the official investigation and decide that they need his "help." (Hint. His idea of help, isn't helping.)

But perhaps simplest of all, is him seeing some of the other characters starting to gather, and joining them whether they like it or not- After all, it seems like fun!

Also? Dibs on dead dude's fedora.

Either would work given his personality and tendencies. Though I don't know how long it will be before everyone meets up in one place.

Page 1 wrote:Well if there's no clear way for you to get involved under normal circumstances then as you suggest we can always have Koyoko courier another of the items required by the Masked Man.

RIP Koyoko.

Maybe even have Mugino going after it as well.

Double RIP.

The question is, do you want to put yourself in that situation? Razz

If that's what we go with then it would make sense for Koyoko to appear the following night after a time skip.

So Mugino, Mirai, Oda and Jin can appear tonight, Koyoko the following night after a timeskip.

Assuming there are no objections all that's left is to figure out Natsumi and Kita/Murakami's entrances.

Page 1 wrote:
Kita Tsukiko wrote:Apologies for taking this long to respond, the last two days have been rather busy. That being said, of anything that I've attempted to come up with, I like your idea of her already investigating the Masked Man before this incident. As I've read from the OOC thus far (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong), but it seems like being out on the night of the murder would be the best place for Kita. So, perhaps her interests were piqued through various rumors and during one of her nighttime escapades, she enters the scene with Jin. 

I know it's pretty uninspired, but I didn't have many great ideas, or rather many ideas period, of how to get Kita involved in this scenario. I know the whole "stumble upon" thing is not that great of an intro, so I might need a helping hand or a kick in the ass to get the juices flowing for an idea that's not just her being at the wrong place at the wrong time.

Well the two aren't mutually exclusive. She could be out looking for evidence of the rumour when she coincidentally stumbles upon the scene of the crime along with Jin, Oda and Mirai. It makes sense, even. Having people be in the right place at the right time isn't a terrible offence, so long as they have a reason for being there.

Hujisaka Natsumi wrote:I feel this thread is gonna be so fun to read with that avatar.  Twisted Evil

As far as I'm concerned, a bit of a writer's block but my primary idea was going alongside Iva's idea: having a job be the reason Natsumi gets involved to investigate, since it's about time I return Miyako to her status of "courier" for Natsumi's jobs.

Railgun manga did introduce the concept of faction ranking, IIRC, so while neither are them are in a faction, it wouldn't be surprising that there would be somewhat of a race going on between factions/agents to get the glory and rewards that come with it.

Or, on the other hand, I could actually play off the events of Arc 3 by having Miyako be the one attempting to investigate the matter and keeping Natsumi out of it, knowing the interest she'd growingly have if she were to investigate herself (and the outcome of the last time she got herself involved in a convoluted mess). Though she'd only manage to fail at it and shoot Natsumi's curiosity up the roof for later instances of the rumour as well.

If you've got any other idea, feel free to bring them up. That's all I have currently.

As we discussed over PM, Miyako would be looking into the rumour as a mission from her handlers in the Dark Side, which gives her a reason to turn up at the scene of the crime.

So. It seems like everyone is set for their introductions. So I give you all permission to post!. First come, first served. We won't worry too much about posting order, for now, just make sure that no one is getting left behind. Koyoko, you'll have to wait for a little I'm afraid. but we'll give you plenty of action once we get started. >Very Happy

Iva, re: Chatbox discussions, Mugino could find the incident first to arrive on the scene due to scanning Anti Skill communications and being notified of suspicious activity. Or she could be the person he was running from in the first place. (he mentions 'losing them', so he was obviously on the run from someone.)

For that matter, the 'monitoring Anti Skill communications' idea could just as easily work for Kita, if you so choose.

Page 2 wrote:Everything's going well so far. I've just added a post detailing the crime scene a bit more thoroughly to give you all some ideas for how to proceed.

Since this is classed as a 'choose your own story' thread I think it's only fair I give you a couple of options to help you out at this point.

Both victims phones are still on the scene. It might be possible to get some information about their movements and intentions if you're able to get into them.

The keys to both victims' living spaces are also there. You may find something at their respective homes that could give you a better picture of what they were up to.

Or you might decide to look into their workplaces?

Failing all of the above you might decide to leave all evidence for Anti-Skill to find and shadow their investigation so they do the hard work for you.


And for the sake of the story, if you decide to take a piece of evidence with you then please leave the rest so that the other characters get a chance. I'd recommend forming groups of 2-3 so you have other characters to interact with (and partially to keep me from going insane keeping track of you all...)

Page 2 wrote:Miyako with the phone, eh? K. Well when she starts cracking into it I'll post up the details of its contents.

I take it Mirai and Oda are heading down to the underpass? So if Mugino and Miyakowant to remain incognito they'll need to make a move in their next post. Otherwise all four of you will meet up. Now I've not got a problem with that, but if you two want to stay hidden then you'll need to escape now.

Iva, have you decided on how you want Mugino to continue? IS she going to let her underlings do the investigating? In which case I'll post up their findings once it comes time for her to hunt down Koyoko, but you won't have anything to do in the meantime. Or she could tail Miyako or one of the others? Or pick up something to investigate herself.

In any case, its time for Mirai and Oda to stumble upon a gruesome sight...

Page 3 wrote:
Oda Taichi wrote:Well, it seems Kita, Jin and Koyoko are having the most trouble getting involved. So maybe you should add some suggestions nows.

Fair enough. But honestly, I think you guys are doing pretty well on your own. And Natsumi already made a nice, comprehensive post while I was away.

So as already suggested, Jin might decide that Koyoko is worth tailing. Someone out on the streets past curfew would already be pretty suspicious, but especially so with a killer on the loose. Not being too familiar with your character I can't say exactly why he'd be out after curfew himself, but there could be any number of reasons, mundane or otherwise. Looking at his profile he prizes freedom highly, so maybe he just doesn't like being told when and where he can go outside? That's something I'd leave to you.

(It would be amusing if half the cast are suspected of being the Masked Man themselves in some way or another.)

For Kita, I believe we spoke about the idea that she's already on the lookout for the Masked Man after hearing about the rumour. In which case as soon as she hears about the crime scene she'd be able to link it to him and investigating any one of the existing leads I've mentioned will give her an easy way to find out about the next delivery. And perhaps while she's 'aquiring' that lead someone else (Jin? Oda? Mirai?) might even spot her tampering with evidence and get involved that way?


In any case, it seems the natural point of connection for everyone would be the incident with Koyoko, giving them all a first-hand experience with the Masked Man that would then give them a reason to search for him further. But all of this is just a suggestion. Very Happy

Page 5 wrote:That's okay. We're still in a position where you can jump in at your own convenience right now. Though obviously as we get further along the less chance you'll have for a longer set up.

Looks like Jin, Taichi and Mirai are on a collision course, so that's good. Do you guys have plans for how you'll cross paths with Koyoko yet? There's still the opportunity to do some amateur detective work or you can go with something a bit more naturalistic.

Natsumi is handling her characters and Mugino is... interrogating her lead. Once that's done I'll give Koyoko his message to pick up the delivery and we'll be on the way towards getting everyone acquainted with our antagonist.

And thank you Natsumi for managing things while I've been otherwise engaged.

slrarthryng wrote:The second concern I know of, is that certain characters were felt to be overshadowing others- Specifically, all of the GM interactions were geared towards specific characters- Mugino and Natsumi. It felt like they were being set up as 'protagonists' while everyone else was literally filler so it didn't look like the thread was moderator exclusive.

Again, I'm sorry that this was the impression you got. However, the reason that Iva and Natsumi's characters were given more to go on was simply that they followed the leads provided to them. The rest of the cast, for one reason or another, ended up following different avenues (this is not a condemnation, as I will again state that I didn't want to railroad people into following the plot hooks provided and was happy for people to come up with their own way in).

This allowed me to write follow up scenes and information for them related to the plot hook they followed (Miyako's decrypting of the phone data which could have potentially led to the delivery company or the victim's apartment or workplace and Mugino's intelligence from ITEM could have led to follow up scenes at any one of the same locations. As it turned out Iva chose the delivery company to investigate.)

The point is that I specifically went into this thread with the idea of giving everyone the same opportunities when it came to acquiring a piece of evidence. (Had Mura decided to move ahead with the 'eavesdropping' opportunity Kita would have been provided a daytime opportunity to grab a piece of evidence from the crime scene. for instance.)

As Lemouri has pointed out already though, this was wishful thinking on my part and perhaps would have required either stricter guidance or more widespread opportunities for the various characters.

I have to admit, the suggestion of favouring the staff is kind of amusing to me, given Iva's earlier reluctance towards the thread. Razz

Slrarthryng wrote:Anyways, apparently we'd been told it was coming. I insist that that is false- None of the people in the scene recall these weekly warnings that it was coming- and regardless, a warning that nobody knows about should not count. What matters is, nothing was said in this OoC thread about it, so I can't say we deserve any blame for finding it unexpected. If it was just one of us who missed it, okay, their bad- But everyone?

While the warnings were not weekly by any means, it had been mentioned that the rendezvous with the Masked Man would be occuring at night, which at least in my mind would necessitate a time skip.

Page 1 wrote:Well if there's no clear way for you to get involved under normal circumstances then as you suggest we can always have Koyoko courier another of the items required by the Masked Man.

RIP Koyoko.

Maybe even have Mugino going after it as well.

Double RIP.

The question is, do you want to put yourself in that situation? Razz

If that's what we go with then it would make sense for Koyoko to appear the following night after a time skip.

So Mugino, Mirai, Oda and Jin can appear tonight, Koyoko the following night after a timeskip.

Assuming there are no objections all that's left is to figure out Natsumi and Kita/Murakami's entrances.

Page 4 wrote:It would make things easier I feel if the delivery took place at night, but I can adapt for daytime if need be.

Page 5 wrote:I figure now is as good a time as any for Kita and Jin to start getting involved as well if you're going to be moving around during the day. If you're going to wait for night then hold off just a short while longer.

Natsumi, Page 7 wrote: I'll be posting myself to give Miyako one last thing to handle during the day before the skip, and that way it should also give the thread a little more boost of activity.

You yourself even commented on it. Unless I'm mistaken about your intention here.

Page 5 wrote:Nobody's quite out and about to attract Jin's eye just yet, so I'll hold off on my entrance for the moment. If I see a good point to be a nuisance, I'll post here to let you guys know, otherwise I'll wait for the night cycle to come around again.

Not to mention the actual post in the IC thread that states that Koyoko's pick up will occur at 10pm.

So with all that said, I'm hoping that I've been able to respond to the complaints with sufficient evidence to dispell any concerns of favouritism or unfairness towards anyone in particular.

Now, of course, if there's something I've missed then please mention it. Better to get this all sorted out now than have any lingering doubts or hard feelings.
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Re: [?] A Certain Masked Man OOC

Post  Takamiya Jin on Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:31 pm

Alright, let me try to clear up some things I said, since my wording was clearly inadequate (And probably still will be, but please, try to bear with me.)

First off, the concerns I mentioned- I would like to reiterate that I wasn't particularly having that problem, but other people saw it that way, and it was not meant to point out a perceived problem that I had, but to point out that in general, people were having concerns with the thread, and despite Lem talking to you, those concerns felt like they were not being addressed. It was not meant to represent my own point of view, as honestly I feel like one of the only people who wasn't feeling overly concerned with how things were progressing. To be fair, that lack of concern may be a problem in and of itself as it led to me being a part of the wasting of time, but as they say, hindsight is 20/20.

As for the timeskip, the point wasn't that it itself was unexpected, but that the scene cutting off at that specific point was unexpected- Which, when pointed out, we were told that there were weekly warnings. We knew there was going to be a night phase, but it was extremely sudden to be told, "Alright, it's night time, work out OoC what happened in between," which led to a lot of gut reactions that were, frankly, not good for anyone involved.

Now as for some of Jack's points- The apparently. Yes, I know it's childish of me, but that doesn't change that I was very vocal about not wanting to get into the middle of this. My opinions are not my own, as I'm basically only able of parroting what other people have said to me- And, lo and behold, despite my saying that, it was looked on as my own opinion, and argued against as such. There's no point in that. You say that there was a need for me to post, but I can't say my saying anything changed a single thing. So I have to disagree on it needing to be done.

I'll skip the next two, as I've already explained that those were not meant as my own viewpoints, but ones I had heard from other people. I'm not going to try and fight their battles for them, nor should I because I suck at talking in general.

As for the Guy threads comment- That actually had a basis in a comment Nacchan said to me on Skype way at the beginning of the thread when I was concerned about characters who were currently in other threads together running into each other- That "There's no grouping involved in Guy's threads usually.
Characters just end up where they should be and where it'll be easier for them to act."

As I said, that's not how must of the threads we've been in have gone through. At least for me, the threads I've been in have all started with the entire cast meeting up, before heading to the specified goal- Whereas what Nacchan's line as well as the issues in our side of the thread have shown, that what was intended was for everyone to find more individual routes to the goal, and trying to have that scene where the cast meets was just slowing everything down. But again, hindsight is 20/20, and I'm not perfect so it could well have just been me incorrectly interpreting people.

Anyways, that was the expectation I was referring to- Not the expectation of working things out with Guy. That was just shitty phrasing on my part. The point was, we thought we were doing the right thing- And with no way to tell otherwise, we had no reason to think to plot our character's involvement more deeply.

The next point was also phrased rather poorly, and I attempted to explain as much above. One warning two weeks beforehand does not constitute weekly warnings, nor does the phrasing involve make it sound like the scene will be cut off halfway- Without everybody ready to move on.

Moving on down- Yes, I was fine with it. As I've said, I wasn't particularly feeling any of the concerns other people were feeling, and was just enjoying RPing. I'm not going to try to defend anyone else on the matter. They can explain their thought processes themselves.

And finally, the brushing off problems because the other side also had problems- That was meant to both sides, not just one or the other. It's a problem I've been seeing a lot, with both sides feeling like the other is ignoring the concerns they have, and how it was feeling like every post except Lem's attempts at cooling tempers were falling into a pattern of "Here's why your problems aren't relevant to the conversation, and by the way, here's issues we have with you."

Again, both sides did that. And the conversation won't move anywhere with nobody willing to take a step back and compromise.
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